Hi racers, Shaggy here again. I'm here to take you through my qualifying lap of the F1 Nations League race at Silverstone, organised by f1setupblog.com.
My fastest lap was a 1:23.389. As always, all driving aids were banned and rules were set to full simulation. Firstly, i'll share with you the setup (a variation of our initial start setup) I used both for qualifying and the race:
Aerodynamics:
Front wing - 10
Rear wing - 11
Braking:
Balance - 40% front, 60% rearwards
Pressure - High
Brake size - Small
Balance:
Front anti-roll bar - 2
Rear anti-roll bar - 11
Suspension:
Front ride height - 1
Rear ride height - 1
Front spring stiffness - 11
Rear spring stiffness - 10
Alignment:
Camber front - 3.50
Camber rear - 1.50
Toe front - 0.05
Toe rear - 0.20
This set-up felt like the most consistent and driveable trade-off between high speed and low speed grip to me. If I went in one direction to improve the handling in one corner, it would worsen my grip in another and vice versa. So I settled with this compromise.
picture by Stephen Hill Photography - CC BY 2.0
Now I will take you through the first sector of the lap, and you can watch the video after at the bottom of the post:
The following in game screenshots were taken by Codemasters F12011 - PS3 Version. Thanks to Codemasters for getting permissions to show ingame sequences.
Turn 1- Abbey:
Turn one, approach in 7th gear
The key for turn one is to turn in early and hug the inside of the corner to avoid understeering wide. With the above setup you should be able to take it flat if you disengage DRS at about half way between the 50 and 100 metre boards (75 metres) and turn in sharply and confidently:
Kiss that apex
You must connect with the apex, and can afford to cut it a little as this is much more preferable to missing it and running wide, resulting in a lift.
Flat out
Keep your foot planted on the throttle and gradually turn out of the corner to straighten the car for best acceleration. I put it back into 6th gear when I felt the revs singing too low in 7th but still kept my foot flat, using all the track but staying away from the grass.
Turn 2 - Farm Curve:
Still flat out....
In the race this is a bit of a nothing corner so long as you've hooked up well with turn one, but in qualifying you need to straighten the car up to get on the DRS as early as possible, so don't take it lightly, find as straight a line as you can.
Approaching turn 3
Now we have the DRS engaged again as we approach turn three, following the rubbered in racing line around the bend, gently bearing right and then left, keeping the lateral load on the car at a minimum.
Turn 3 - Village
Braking hard for Village
The first braking point of the lap, brake hard initially at around the 100 metre board, banging through the gears down to 2nd and sweep into the corner, gradually coming off the brakes by the time you're at the apex:
Right front on the inside kerb
You must connect with the apex - that's where the grip is, not to mention it being the best geometric line through the corner. You must resist carrying too much speed into the corner - although it is wide, you need to get back over to the right of the track ASAP for the next slow corner:
Turn 4 - The Loop:
Not using all the track on the left deliberately, keeping right for the next corner
So now i've got turn 3 out of the way, I want the car nice and straight and on the grippy line again for the approach to turn 4:
Braking again, wheels already pointed left
Brake again briefly when you're level with the kerb on the right and turn in with quite a lot of steering arm, using 1st gear to kill the understeer:
Try to make the apex, unlike me!
I turned in fractionally too late for the speed I was carrying and consequently never made the apex, but no problem - I'm still on the grippy racing line and most importantly I am now able to pick up the throttle very early. The consequences of turning in too early to this corner are much worse than that of turning in too late, so it's best erring on the side of caution.
DRS open already
Taking the correct line through The Loop should allow you to get on the throttle early and enable you to use all the road available to you on the right, so that the car is as straight as possible, the load is removed and the DRS is wide open as early as 2nd gear. Once you reach 3rd gear, deploy a decent helping of KERS, I used about 2/5 of it.
Turn 5 - Aintree
Easily flat, only with DRS and KERS
Make sure you keep your steering angle as straight as possible through Aintree, taking plenty of the inside kerb but not so much as to cut the corner and invalidate the lap. I partly chose the 10/11 wing balance in order to keep the DRS open through Aintree, and stop the back end from stepping out of line:
Wheels nice and straight
Still in the corner, not only is it important not to turn in too early and cut the corner, but turning in too early also puts excess lateral load on the car and hurts acceleration through the exit (also meaning needless DRS disengagement). Even in the race without DRS, it's the little details like this, beyond basic braking, turning and accelerating that shave off the hundredths.Watching the lap, you will see that I had acres of track available but used one prescribed, smooth arc. With this gradual and deliberate steering arc, I was able to keep the DRS open the whole way through.
Wellington Straight:
Not a lot to do here other than take a breath
I used a little bit of kerb on the right so as to use the line of least resistance. If you take Aintree too sharply, you have all the green run off on the right there to use if you need. Keep your eyes ahead now, concentrate for the next braking point.
Turn 6 - Brooklands:
Don't brake too late
Brooklands is a corner that many struggle with and there's a simple reason for this - since it's a medium speed corner with a wide entry they get greedy, brake too late and therefore understeer wide, which then ruins their line for the next corner as well. I found setting the brake balance fully rearwards for maximum turn-in really helped in this regard. Brake just before the 100 metre board, turn in early and progressively come off the brakes to guide the car through:
Keep it tight, but avoid the bollards
Without the aforementioned brake balance, I might have gone straight on at this corner judging by this picture........
Hug the inside like it's your favourite granny
But not so, I make the corner and my front left is well over onto the kerb, shortening the track and carrying good speed through the apex. This corner is taken in 3rd gear.
Turn 7 - Luffield:
Take a narrow approach to Luffield
You can afford to go deep through the exit of Brooklands, so as to set up a tight line into Luffield as you see here. Even though it's a right hander approaching, I don't want to get over to the left as I normally would, here's why:
Aim the right front tyre at the inside kerb
Since Luffield is such a long and deep corner, you want an extremely late apex. The best way to do this is to take the narrow approach, and simply throw the car into the corner in 2nd gear with plenty of steering lock, letting the tyre scrub slow the car down without killing too much speed, only gently touching the brakes to kill any understeer, and then simply waiting for the moment to unleash your 750 bhp again. This technique is not only superior over one lap, but more consistent lap after lap rather than hugging the inside line which would require very patient and careful throttle application with a slower exit speed.
waiting almost over....
The lateral load, or tyre scrub on the car in this case is your friend as it slows the car down for you. You can afford to go fairly deep into this corner as it will give a later apex and therefore a straighter and faster car on exit. Either way, it's about feeling when to put the power down again without running wide on the exit. This is down to feeling and practice, I cannot say exactly how this must be done but I can say you should have one smooth steering motion through the corner, without many corrections. If you're correcting the steering constantly then you know you haven't found the best line.
Using ALL the kerb
I judged it pretty well, and got onto the DRS even before I reached this run off. You shouldn't be aiming for this run off kerb as such however, the car should just naturally drive towards it. If you find yourself consciously aiming for it rather than it conveniently coming at you as you're straightening up the car, then you're not taking enough speed out of Luffield. Remember, don't go chasing run off areas, focus on corner speed and early throttle and the track boundaries will come to you rather than you going to them.
And that is the first sector done. You can watch it in full flow by clicking this link - My onboard lap.
Next time, I will tackle the middle sector with the famous high-speed corners of Copse, Maggots and Becketts. Please give my tutorial a go and see how you get on. We appreciate the feedback and would be keen to hear how everyone does :)
Thank you very much for all the details really helpful!!
Shaggy do you think you could do something similar for Malaysia? I can't go below 1.26 online qualy and I don't know what any other setup to try, I've tried so many different setups...
Hey encedalus, thanks for the comment. Plenty of what i'm saying is just general tips that apply across every type of circuit, so I hope they will be able to help in general.
Incidentally our next Nations League race is at Sepang, so I could do the same thing again, but it would depend on it being dry, on me doing a half decent lap and on them actually being able to record it. One thing I will say though is that if you're doing low 1:26's that's already very fast at Sepang so I wouldn't be so disappointed!
If you're ever unsure about your lines, sometimes I find a bit of reflection in looking at the real F1 drivers helps me. Just watch their lines and the way they lean on each corner and sometimes it refreshes your whole approach. It's helped me numerous times :)
Hi Shaggy, i see you use the first gear quite frequently,and that`s not normal with F1 cars as it is only used for starting.I sometimes meet racers online with your style whom are just out for quick times, and really its not nice to watch, never the less,i like what your doing m8
Yeah but I see these guys in ARL or Nations League doing low-mid 25's and I keep wondering what I can do to improve. I feel my gearbox is right as transition between 5th 6th and 7th is fast and I reach the limiter 150-200 meters before the end of the straights.
Do you think using KERS with lower gears is better than using it with top gears? I understand it will depend on the circuit, in the end it's all about using the less time possible in doing a straight as a result of a compromise between acceleration and top speed. In Malaysia my first gears are longer than the last gears so I'm using KERS with shorts to optimise acceleration.
Hi again, KERS usage is something i've wondered about before and i'd never known definitively which way works best, other than that I do it as they do in real F1.
It makes sense that you would use the KERS boost of 80 Bhp at the start of a straight as you are then carrying that speed the whole way down it, and you are using this extra acceleration while the drag is at its lowest, as obviously air resistance will be higher the faster you are going....
HOWEVER
I had always wondered if this was properly replicated in the game, so inspired by your comment I decided to do a test to find out which way works best in F1 2011. These were the conditions:
I used the main, longest straight at Korea as a test site. I ran with default gear ratios, mix 3 but no DRS. I did a standing start from the beginning of the straight with full traction control in order to get a perfect start each time, and I tried these 3 different KERS deployments:
1. Using all KERS starting from 3rd gear 2. Using all KERS starting from 6th gear 3. Using all KERS starting from 7th gear
and these were the respective top speeds:
1. 331 KPH 2. 335 KPH 3. 338 KPH
So in actual fact, using KERS in the higher gears gives you better top speed, so the game does not correctly simulate the drag effect. Although this would appear to suggest that using KERS in 6th and 7th gear is the only time you should do it, there is a proviso; presumably I reached my top speed quicker using KERS in the lower gears so carried this speed along the straight for longer. But ultimately, to be a full 7 KPH slower at the end of a straight, just from using KERS differently surely suggests that using it in the higher gears is the way forward, so long as you are able to spend enough time in the higher gears for it to be worthwhile before the next corner.
That said, I reckon this benefit might only add up to a few hundredths throughout the lap. As you say, it's a compromise between acceleration and top speed. Top speed is just a snapshot of the overall speed. To get to your lower top speed quicker will sometimes be more beneficial than getting to a higher top speed slower ;)
I'd do this same test with automatic gears and traction control starting from 0 km/h and compare not only top speed at the end of the straight but the time actually used to reach the end of the straight.
If you recorded the laps it'd be really easy to see how much time, to the millisecond, took you to do the straight. I'll try it soon.
Well these were my results. Malaysia, all aids on, engineer setup, same starting point (back straight), same kerb point, full acceleration straight line until the 50 meter sign.
KERS@ time top speed 3d 13,45s 331 km/h 4th 13,51s 332 km/h 5th 13,51s 334 km/h 6th 13,56s 335 km/h 7th 13,78s 334 km/h
Very interesting encedalus, so are your times the time it took to get from one end to the other end of the straight? So in other words, you went 3 tenths faster by using KERS in 3rd gear over 7th gear, in one straight alone, despite having a lower top speed?
I suspect since Malaysia's straight is a bit shorter than Korea's, it was always going to be more beneficial using KERS at the start of the straight. I think possibly using KERS in high gears is only worth it if it's for a decent duration of time e.g. Korea, Monza, Abu Dhabi, any track where you're in 7th gear for a longer time than usual.
Thanks for your test any way, it's very revealing.
So I guess that would mean that it might be more beneficial to use more KERS out of Ascari then out of the first chicane at Monza? It's more based on the length of the straight rather then the speed your going at the start of the straight? Maybe?
Shaggy- Nice lap at Silverstone, really makes my 1:25s seem pathetic lol :)
how many straights there are and how long they are What your longer gears are
My test does not necessarily mean you are going to be baster starting to use KERS at 3d gear. In Monza if you have a very long 7th it would be more benefitial to use it with 7th rather than 4th or 5th since Monza straights are quite long. If you use KERS with shorter gears the time you gain at the beginning is lost at the end because the lenght of the straight. However if the straight is not long enough and your 7th gear is short enough to reach the limiter at the end of it, then it'd be better to use it at the beginning.
In the end there's no exact math in this. Sorry it's a messy explanation, hope you understand me.
I completely understand and agree with you. As I said in the last post, the rule roughly speaking is to use KERS in 7th gear if the duration in that gear is long enough in the straight.
Using it out of Ascari is a pretty good idea as you arrive on the start of straight in 5th gear, I would probably use 1/4 KERS as soon as you cross the start/finish line, a 1/3 exiting the first chicane, 1/4 exiting the second Lesmo then the rest out of Ascari.
@ Jcm, thank you. I began by lapping in the 1:25's and kept knocking the time off it till I arrived in the high 1:23's. I kept refining my lap to knock off another 2-3 tenths, then just hooked up a very good lap in my final run in Qualifying on the night, it is still my PB lap time there.
Rest assured, 1:25's would put you right in the thick of it in the Nations League, it's a good lap time.
Wow, just gave this tune a try in my expert career with HRT. I got held up a little by traffic, but I still got a Q3 lap of 1:29.0xx. 5th on the grid :) Thanks for the great setup :) Good luck in your next nations league race, though if you're setup in Malaysia is this good you won't need any luck lol :)
Hello the only assists i use is traction and im doing 1:25's in quali i have a ferrari steering wheel could traction be worth that much time ? because Im in a racing league and people are doing 1:24's and thats with no assists thanks
a little hint from my side which might help. concentrate more on your sector times. After every stint when you are back in the pits, go to race director and write down your sector times. Do this for about 5 stints and look at the differences in the sector times. There you can see best where you have problems and what time you would produce when you sum up your best sector times.
cheers dark will do :) also any recommendations on a steering wheel my down shift just broke on my ferrari wheel and was wondering whats the best to get
Hi Ciaran, I use the G27, it's robust and reliable and works extremely well, but if you can pick up a G25 cheaper i'd go with that as it's virtually as good, and actually gave more sensitive feedback than the G27 did with F1 2010 at least, meaning I could actually lap more consistently with the G25 than I could with the G27.
Hay, I loved your idea of this so much, I have actually stolen it and am going to be doing one for every track, I will give you honourable mention for giving me the idea of course :P I am not as fast as you, but my camera quality is much better :P
Thank you very much for all the details really helpful!!
ReplyDeleteShaggy do you think you could do something similar for Malaysia? I can't go below 1.26 online qualy and I don't know what any other setup to try, I've tried so many different setups...
Hey encedalus, thanks for the comment. Plenty of what i'm saying is just general tips that apply across every type of circuit, so I hope they will be able to help in general.
ReplyDeleteIncidentally our next Nations League race is at Sepang, so I could do the same thing again, but it would depend on it being dry, on me doing a half decent lap and on them actually being able to record it. One thing I will say though is that if you're doing low 1:26's that's already very fast at Sepang so I wouldn't be so disappointed!
If you're ever unsure about your lines, sometimes I find a bit of reflection in looking at the real F1 drivers helps me. Just watch their lines and the way they lean on each corner and sometimes it refreshes your whole approach. It's helped me numerous times :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVGEWn8wlH0
Keep pushing.
Hi Shaggy, i see you use the first gear quite frequently,and that`s not normal with F1 cars as it is only used for starting.I sometimes meet racers online with your style whom are just out for quick times, and really its not nice to watch, never the less,i like what your doing m8
DeleteYeah but I see these guys in ARL or Nations League doing low-mid 25's and I keep wondering what I can do to improve. I feel my gearbox is right as transition between 5th 6th and 7th is fast and I reach the limiter 150-200 meters before the end of the straights.
ReplyDeleteDo you think using KERS with lower gears is better than using it with top gears? I understand it will depend on the circuit, in the end it's all about using the less time possible in doing a straight as a result of a compromise between acceleration and top speed. In Malaysia my first gears are longer than the last gears so I'm using KERS with shorts to optimise acceleration.
Hi again, KERS usage is something i've wondered about before and i'd never known definitively which way works best, other than that I do it as they do in real F1.
DeleteIt makes sense that you would use the KERS boost of 80 Bhp at the start of a straight as you are then carrying that speed the whole way down it, and you are using this extra acceleration while the drag is at its lowest, as obviously air resistance will be higher the faster you are going....
HOWEVER
I had always wondered if this was properly replicated in the game, so inspired by your comment I decided to do a test to find out which way works best in F1 2011. These were the conditions:
I used the main, longest straight at Korea as a test site. I ran with default gear ratios, mix 3 but no DRS. I did a standing start from the beginning of the straight with full traction control in order to get a perfect start each time, and I tried these 3 different KERS deployments:
1. Using all KERS starting from 3rd gear
2. Using all KERS starting from 6th gear
3. Using all KERS starting from 7th gear
and these were the respective top speeds:
1. 331 KPH
2. 335 KPH
3. 338 KPH
So in actual fact, using KERS in the higher gears gives you better top speed, so the game does not correctly simulate the drag effect. Although this would appear to suggest that using KERS in 6th and 7th gear is the only time you should do it, there is a proviso; presumably I reached my top speed quicker using KERS in the lower gears so carried this speed along the straight for longer. But ultimately, to be a full 7 KPH slower at the end of a straight, just from using KERS differently surely suggests that using it in the higher gears is the way forward, so long as you are able to spend enough time in the higher gears for it to be worthwhile before the next corner.
That said, I reckon this benefit might only add up to a few hundredths throughout the lap. As you say, it's a compromise between acceleration and top speed. Top speed is just a snapshot of the overall speed. To get to your lower top speed quicker will sometimes be more beneficial than getting to a higher top speed slower ;)
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI'd do this same test with automatic gears and traction control starting from 0 km/h and compare not only top speed at the end of the straight but the time actually used to reach the end of the straight.
ReplyDeleteIf you recorded the laps it'd be really easy to see how much time, to the millisecond, took you to do the straight. I'll try it soon.
Well these were my results. Malaysia, all aids on, engineer setup, same starting point (back straight), same kerb point, full acceleration straight line until the 50 meter sign.
ReplyDeleteKERS@ time top speed
3d 13,45s 331 km/h
4th 13,51s 332 km/h
5th 13,51s 334 km/h
6th 13,56s 335 km/h
7th 13,78s 334 km/h
Very interesting encedalus, so are your times the time it took to get from one end to the other end of the straight? So in other words, you went 3 tenths faster by using KERS in 3rd gear over 7th gear, in one straight alone, despite having a lower top speed?
ReplyDeleteI suspect since Malaysia's straight is a bit shorter than Korea's, it was always going to be more beneficial using KERS at the start of the straight. I think possibly using KERS in high gears is only worth it if it's for a decent duration of time e.g. Korea, Monza, Abu Dhabi, any track where you're in 7th gear for a longer time than usual.
Thanks for your test any way, it's very revealing.
So I guess that would mean that it might be more beneficial to use more KERS out of Ascari then out of the first chicane at Monza? It's more based on the length of the straight rather then the speed your going at the start of the straight? Maybe?
ReplyDeleteShaggy- Nice lap at Silverstone, really makes my 1:25s seem pathetic lol :)
jcm at the end it's a mix of several things:
ReplyDeletehow many straights there are and how long they are
What your longer gears are
My test does not necessarily mean you are going to be baster starting to use KERS at 3d gear. In Monza if you have a very long 7th it would be more benefitial to use it with 7th rather than 4th or 5th since Monza straights are quite long. If you use KERS with shorter gears the time you gain at the beginning is lost at the end because the lenght of the straight. However if the straight is not long enough and your 7th gear is short enough to reach the limiter at the end of it, then it'd be better to use it at the beginning.
In the end there's no exact math in this. Sorry it's a messy explanation, hope you understand me.
I completely understand and agree with you. As I said in the last post, the rule roughly speaking is to use KERS in 7th gear if the duration in that gear is long enough in the straight.
DeleteUsing it out of Ascari is a pretty good idea as you arrive on the start of straight in 5th gear, I would probably use 1/4 KERS as soon as you cross the start/finish line, a 1/3 exiting the first chicane, 1/4 exiting the second Lesmo then the rest out of Ascari.
@ Jcm, thank you. I began by lapping in the 1:25's and kept knocking the time off it till I arrived in the high 1:23's. I kept refining my lap to knock off another 2-3 tenths, then just hooked up a very good lap in my final run in Qualifying on the night, it is still my PB lap time there.
Rest assured, 1:25's would put you right in the thick of it in the Nations League, it's a good lap time.
Wow, just gave this tune a try in my expert career with HRT. I got held up a little by traffic, but I still got a Q3 lap of 1:29.0xx. 5th on the grid :) Thanks for the great setup :) Good luck in your next nations league race, though if you're setup in Malaysia is this good you won't need any luck lol :)
DeleteNice one, the HRTs are maybe around 5 seconds off the pace so presumably you're in the 1:24's now if not 1:23's :) Keep it up
DeleteShaggy
Hello the only assists i use is traction and im doing 1:25's in quali i have a ferrari steering wheel could traction be worth that much time ? because Im in a racing league and people are doing 1:24's and thats with no assists thanks
ReplyDeleteHi Ciaran, TC is normally a benefit in lap time. Have you tried my setup above? It helped JCM to improve his times around Silverstone.
ReplyDeleteyeh got a bit faster 1.24's dont know why I can lose a second with same set up :(
ReplyDeleteHi ciaran,
Deletea little hint from my side which might help.
concentrate more on your sector times. After every stint when you are back in the pits, go to race director and write down your sector times.
Do this for about 5 stints and look at the differences in the sector times.
There you can see best where you have problems and what time you would produce when you sum up your best sector times.
keep racing
DarkPSI
cheers dark will do :) also any recommendations on a steering wheel my down shift just broke on my ferrari wheel and was wondering whats the best to get
ReplyDeleteHi Ciaran, I use the G27, it's robust and reliable and works extremely well, but if you can pick up a G25 cheaper i'd go with that as it's virtually as good, and actually gave more sensitive feedback than the G27 did with F1 2010 at least, meaning I could actually lap more consistently with the G25 than I could with the G27.
ReplyDeleteWhat are your gears here?
ReplyDeleteHey PJ, how are you? The gears are simply the default settings, only with 7th gear shortened by 2 clicks.
ReplyDeleteHay, I loved your idea of this so much, I have actually stolen it and am going to be doing one for every track, I will give you honourable mention for giving me the idea of course :P I am not as fast as you, but my camera quality is much better :P
ReplyDeleteHey Jess, I only just got this message. That's really cool, please send us the link when you've done it.
ReplyDelete